Question about new "Live At Fillmore East" DVD [Archive]

View Full Version : Question about new "Live At Fillmore East" DVD

jimisite

09-21-11, 11:28 PM

J.Lucas

09-22-11, 01:44 AM

I saw this at my local record store as the new "Deluxe Edition" and was wondering if anyone's purchased it and if so, what's different? I already own it and really don't want to buy it again. The label mentioned something about 5.1 surround sound... Yeah....these Legacy releases are getting confusing to me.....I have the MCA DVD also...but the NEW release has the Eddie Kramer mix on it....however a guy at amazon swears the new audio is worth the upgrade....even if you don't have a 5.1 system(I don't) http://www.amazon.com/Jimi-Hendrix-Band-Gypsys-Live-Fillmore/dp/B004NCOQVA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1316671491&sr=8-3 (http://www.amazon.com/Jimi-Hendrix-Band-Gypsys-Live-Fillmore/dp/B004NCOQVA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1316671491&sr=8-3%20) ...no new film footage or anything else added....audio upgrade ONLY...I'll probably grab one...just having the B/W footage of Jimi doing 'Machine Gun' was worth the price of it in the 1st place for me...now with new audio...yeah...I'll probably get one...lol Personally I don't think these new Legacy releases are selling to well(I mean the DVD, s)...maybe people are finally getting wise to the 'shit...I just paid $$$ for the same the CD I have'...just to get a 7mt video clip of Eddie Kramer in the "Deluxe Edition'....Isle of Wight DVD has an upgrade in the 'Second Look' feature also...some more video...and more than 3 times cheaper than the older version....however I found the D/L of that. My problem now is what the heck is the Legacy Woodstock one about....seems many descriptions are using the older version or there is no difference...some say 'pic in pic' feature showing the 'Second Look' B/W footage at the same time as an option..other descriptions say new edited footage put in....so I don't yet...I have to admit.....I really hate the Blu-Ray DVDs of Woodstock....heck they hack off the top and bottom of the screen to try an create the illusion that it was filmed in widescreen.....to make people thinking they are getting more when picture when it's actually less....man..look what they did in the WCSB DVD(and TV version)...we finally see some new Berkeley 'Voodoo Child' and 'Hear My Train Comin'...and then they hack off parts of Jimi's head and guitar....to make it look pretty for the widescreen....geeez They keep editing and hacking off this and that and Jimi Hendrix may just be a fading memory by the next generation of fans(the ones that will most likel see the "Albert Hall' DVD.....:) Sorry to ramble..if you are anyone has the Legacy Woodstock 2010 DVD could you post your review

thank you
J.L.

copen

09-25-11, 09:04 PM

i'm going to have this soon. i think (hope) that the simple answer is that the old bog dvd uses the audio from the film cameras.
the new bog dvd uses the audio from the audio recording that kramer made for the bog lp.
i'd like to know more about the new woodstock dvd reissue. if it does have alternate camera angles in the bonus features.

Voodoo Kush

09-26-11, 06:50 AM

DevilsAvocado

09-26-11, 09:53 AM

Remember the old 1999 release where the sound wasn't all that great? The 2011 audio soundtrack features a brand new stereo and 5.1 stereo surround mix by none other than Eddie Kramer (whoopie!;). There's nothing extra about it as far as footage goes though.

Always wondered why they didnt do that in the first place.... I was really bummed about the sound back then. Of course, being able to watch THAT version of MACHINE GUN outweighed the negatives. Don't know if i'll be getting this new one... To tell you the truth, i don't think the show is that great, taken as a whole, and the documentary is largely annoying. Frankie Crocker obviously knew zero about the Band Of Gypsys, and the Allen twins apparently practically invented the BOG idea, and sold it to Jimi.... The only one who comes across as being somewhat humble is Billy, and the only amusing bit is Mitch's evaluation of Buddy's drumming style! Don't need that in 5.1. I only have 2 ears...

carlygtr56

09-26-11, 11:27 AM

The new mix taken off the BOG Master reels is worth the $10, IMO What ticks me off is why not do the same to the color BOG footage?

J.Lucas

09-26-11, 05:46 PM

The new mix taken off the BOG Master reels is worth the $10, IMO What ticks me off is why not do the same to the color BOG footage?

Yeah....'specially when the cover states 'all existing color and b/w footage'
J.L.

LE-20

09-27-11, 07:13 AM

It's easy..The sound synched with the B&W footage is the best sound ever released of any BOG concert... If you don't get it you are really missing out.

jeffhmason

09-27-11, 10:06 AM

Personally I appreciate the little upgrades to the BOG and IOW discs, however I can't justify re-purchasing until they come out on Blu Ray. I just won't buy these on DVD again, period.

stplsd

09-27-11, 05:57 PM

Major drawback, the sound is reversed, guitar on the right! means you have to swap your speakers around to get a sound that relates to the film, which is a pain in the f'in arse, ffcks sake, you've had over forty years, and two releases, get it right EH!

copen

09-27-11, 09:45 PM

mine has guitar on the left.

now that kramer has put soundboard audio onto this film, we have the following new soundboard tunes:
foxy lady, earth blues.

upgraded soundboard:
them changes

stplsd

09-29-11, 02:59 PM

mine has guitar on the left.

What is their stupid game of cutting out audio and sticking up a stupid notice saying this part wasn't filmed, they could write that on the box! Arrogant, no imagination, air-heads!

zombywoof57

09-29-11, 09:04 PM

Always wondered why they didnt do that in the first place.... I was really bummed about the sound back then. Of course, being able to watch THAT version of MACHINE GUN outweighed the negatives. Don't know if i'll be getting this new one... To tell you the truth, i don't think the show is that great, taken as a whole, and the documentary is largely annoying. Frankie Crocker obviously knew zero about the Band Of Gypsys, and the Allen twins apparently practically invented the BOG idea, and sold it to Jimi.... The only one who comes across as being somewhat humble is Billy, and the only amusing bit is Mitch's evaluation of Buddy's drumming style! Don't need that in 5.1. I only have 2 ears... so they can sell it again and again and yet again, just i aint buying it

zombywoof57

09-29-11, 09:05 PM

after all the editing is there ANY guitar"LEFT"?

bolexje

10-04-11, 03:07 PM

So I have done an extensive run of the two existing "Live at Fillmore East" DVD's, and compared them with my own transfer of the BOG material ( which is available here on CTT in the video-torrents ).

First of all the good news :

1. it looks like Experience Hendrix did a completely new transfer of the reel-to-reel video tapes of Jan Blom and Vasulka. The strange digital effects where the picture would suddenly go up and down on the old transfer are gone, and there are less drop-outs ( could be digitally enhanced )

2. Secondly they made a completely new edit of the two camera's, which is not any more exciting as their original edit but at least it's 'different' ( cutting from floor camera to balcony camera happens at different moments then the first DVD, therefore different material can be seen ) .

3. They made the total tape more 'complete'. They added the full introduction in the beginning, so now all members of BOG are introduced.

4. They added two soundtracks of really good quality, the new Eddie Kramer mixes. A stereo PCM mix, which sounds very dry and direct, plus a dolby 5.1 mix with much more reverb and hall effect.

I know, this sounds all good, and for me it was worth it to buy this new BOG DVD, but here are the bad points:

1. The reel-to-reel tapes have severely deteriorated. The new transfer looks like it is really loosing detail in the light and dark area's, and any sharpness that was ( already minimally ) present in the original , seems to be gone now. For instance, on the intro of Machine Gun you can barely see Jimi's hand move as he strums the opening notes. This is something which we cannot blame anybody for. I have recently had a specialist transfer some other reel-to-reel tapes ( non-hendrix ), and he showed me how these tapes are really falling apart after a while. They are not nearly as stable as sound-tapes.

2. They did not do a good transfer. Where the old transfer on the original DVD was rather blackish, therefore losing all details in the dark, in this new transfer they have cranked up the whites, and we see even less. To me it is almost unwatchable.

3. They did not add an 'angle' choice, as they did on the Isle of Wight DVD, where you can choose between the angles. Frankly, I don't care about that too much, because it looks pretty bad already.

Now I also checked the quality against my own material, that I had on a time-coded VHS, and that I have 'liberated' here on CTT. To my eyes that is still the best looking quality transfer available. It has details in the dark, and still some sharpness in the grey and white area's. My guess is that when that transfer was made, back in 1989, the reel-to-reel tapes were in better condition, plus that transfer was done in PAL, as opposed to the later NTSC transfers by Experience Hendrix. The Timecode is still annoying to me, but as I have not been able to track down the original Betacamtape of the 1989 transfer ( which will probably look better then anything we have now ), this is what we have to do with.

The new sound on the DVD really is very interesting, and it is unfortunate that we have to listen to that now with the inferior image-quality.
I would love it if somebody would be able to add that sound to my original torrent of the BOG tapes, and reseed that, as I feel that is the only way to get it right.

http://www.crosstowntorrents.org/showthread.php?787-fillmore-1-1-70-balcony-video

http://www.crosstowntorrents.org/showthread.php?962-MORE-FILLMORE-1-1-70-BOG-FLOOR-video

So there you have it.

Sharpstat

10-04-11, 08:25 PM

IIRC, It was originally recorded on 3/4" tape? Too bad they have messed with black levels to get a different "look".I still wish they would release ALL of the Jimi videos in the Blu Ray format! Thanks for the review.

bolexje

10-06-11, 09:57 AM

J.Lucas

10-08-11, 05:41 PM

I will add one thing to my comparison of the three different Fillmore sources:

Most importantly : There is another DVD for sale now ( has been for sale for ages) , the two-disc special of " A Film About Jimi Hendrix" ( the old 70's documentary ), which on the bonus disc has an integral 'Machine Gun' track from the old B&W tape, in better quality then the two actual Band of Gypsys DVD's . And this one also has the perfect soundtrack , as they have added the old Machine Gun mix from the original record/cd.

Wow...looks like they did the 'crop-job' on the image as well in the 'new' BOG dvd.....
Thank you for the heads up about the 'A Film about Jimi Hendrix' DVD set.....man...I was hanging on to my old VHS just because it was the full screen image....our US version(2005) has the image 'zoomed-in' and cropped....I see the UK(2006) version is a 2 DVD set... not only has it in full screen and wide screen but has the UK only 'machine gun' BOG special feature...we didn't get that here...
I did find the full screen from DVD1(can actually see Jimi working his pedals,etc in the Woodstock footage)...but have not seen DVD2 as of yet....is the BOG machine gun the full video of that song or just the clip they show in the original movie?
Does the menu from disc 1 look like this?
9356

9354

9355

Always loved the scene where he steps on the wah, then fuzz then back to the wah...to do the 'falling bomb' effect..I missed it in the 2005 version..
BTW...the scene in not in either ' Woodstock Definitive Version' nor the 'Live at Woodstock' DVDs..it's unique to the 'Film about Jimi Hendrix'.

yelapavision

10-08-11, 06:27 PM

The USA version of Deluxe Woodstock is cropped, and the English is not? Well, that's some good info, thank you for that.

yelapavision

10-08-11, 06:27 PM

also thanks very much for the detailed comparisons of the Band Of Gypsys videotapes.

J.Lucas

10-08-11, 07:24 PM

The USA version of Deluxe Woodstock is cropped, and the English is not? Well, that's some good info, thank you for that.

No......I have no idea if the UK Woodstock is cropped...I'm pretty sure it is....
it's the 'Film about Jimi Hendrix'(origin 1973)....the US 2005 DVD is cropped.....the UK 2006 2 DVD special edition has cropped and non-cropped versions on disc 1 and the features on disc 2 along with the UK exclusive UK BOG(machine gun) feature.
J.L.

troy

10-09-11, 01:36 AM

I just got the deluxe 2 dvd 'Woodstock' 2010 version.
I first watched it in 98? 99? when on video.
This is a killer version, the audio mix is way better.
But the second disc WOW!!!
It was like i was watching it again for thye very first time!
I actually prefer the second look, because it shows all Jimi's little things, you don't see on the main disc.
WOW, i really had tears in my eyes!
I love it!
Janie & CO finally got something for us!
Thanx, i suppose.
But most of all, I love you Jimi, you will always be amazing.
And if Villanova Junction is not the best piece of live guitar work ever-period, than I dont know what to say!
Hendrix Woodstock, i love it...but then again i love all Jimi.
Oh & by the way, hi, my first ever reply/post etc
Great to be here with you all, I am in awe of all ur knowledge and it's great to be around other Hendrix freaks/officianados, if you will!!!
Love to you all, Troy
Sydney, OZ

purple jim

10-09-11, 03:32 AM

Hi Troy, welcome to the forum!

yelapavision

10-09-11, 04:17 AM

Papi

10-09-11, 10:03 AM

I have "a film about Jimi Hendrix" 2006 2 disc version for Finnish market and it has only cropped version of the film on disc 1. Does U.K. version have a menu option for non-cropped version?

J.Lucas

10-09-11, 10:19 AM

OK, thank you, got confused there for a moment. it's "A Film About Jimi Hendrix" that has differences between the US and UK versions.

<the UK 2006 2 DVD special edition has cropped and non-cropped versions on disc 1 >

Could you elaborate on this a bit please? Is it the difference between 4:3 and 16:9 aspect ratio?
If you are the mikeparker that made the Maui video(with the Rainbow Bridge/out takes/Strange Day at Maui footage ...you must know....otherwise........)
I'm from the US and I am not sure about other parts of the world...tho' I had understanding the Euro-Asian markets were more advanced than the US in audio/video reproduction technology.....say like the PAL format has more lines of resolution than NTSC...tho' NTSC has a faster frame rate than PAL.
which means the PAL makes a bit 'sharper' image and NTSC makes a bit 'smoother playing' image...which is undetectable to me)
FLAC is more popular than MPG in Euro-Asia....
Video Laser Discs are more popular in Euro-Asia
same with Reel to Reel Tape recording...
the US is always about friggin' 'convenience' rather than quality...it's been this way as far back as I can remember.
not sure about the vinyl market tho'....I'm just guessing that vinyl would sell more in Euro-Asia than the US....US is more into CD market.
Ok...getting on with it.........
basically the 4:3 ratio produces a ..say a square shaped picture [_]
16:9 ratio produces a rectangle shaped picture [___]
Being that just about everything film of Jimi Hendrix whether TV or movie was filmed at approx 4:3...there are other ratios as well...VLC player lets you change them easily to see what I mean)...
the current 'fad' with the wide screen TV sets(monitors)...would produce 'black bars' on the sides of the 4:3 picture to fit the image.(these never bothered me at all as it does some people) when movies first started appearing in full screen/wide screen formats on the 'new' DVD(back in the early 90's).
If a movie was filmed in wide screen...they used to 'crop off' the sides to accommodate the 90's TV sets.(non-digital).
In the early days of DVDs when a movie was released....they would make 2 sided DVDs...one side had the
'full screen' format.....flip it over and the other side had the 'wide screen format'(you actually got 2 copies of the film)...then as the TV market started changing to the wide screen....greed took over (as usual) and they started releasing 'full screen' and 'wide screen' on separate DVDs(to increase profit).
Heck I remember running around to various stores looking for the 'wide screen' version of a movie because 9 out 10 stores only carried the 'full screen' format.
I always had a VHS version of 'Film About Jimi Hendrix' and I loved the part at the beginning od the SSB footage(which differs a bit (due to alternate angles) from Live at Woodstock DVD/VHS and 2 DVD Definitive Woodstock) to be able to see Jimi working his pedals.(see images I uploaded in above post..one is the 4;3 capture the other 16:9 capture)
In 2005 I grabbed the US-NTSC version 'Film about Jimi Hendrix' special deluxe edition(these titles kill me sometimes)...
much to my surprise they has 'chopped off' the top and bottom of the picture(no other reason than to fit better on a wide screen monitor....the cover states the film is released in the theatrical ratio,,,so I guess the people that saw the film back in the '70's saw cropped image...or they are bull-shitting.
The below image is from the US Film Jimi Hendrix
you can notice a bit more picture on the left/right than the 4:3 image.
9364

this is from the UK DVD full screen side...
seems either way something gets cropped out...
9365
also NOTICE: If you view the extra hour of interviews that were edited out of the final theatrical release(special feature) they are in 4:3 ...not 16:9 as they claim.
So I was elated to see the post that mentioned the BOG footage from the 2006 2 DVD UK version of 'Film Jimi Hendrix"..I never knew it existed...found a d/l and sure enough...original size...got my footage of the pedals in DVD now....tho' I don't have DVD 2 with the BOG(machine gun) UK only special feature.

I am not a fan of cropping videos! The Christmas On Earth Continued stuff on the "Experience" (otherwise known as See My Music Talking" is also cropped, compared to the boot video version.
I'm not a fan of cropping either..there isn't a whole ton of Hendrix footage and the footage I like is the original filmed size....not edited....much like how some people don't like the edits on the new Winterland release...I just happen to be a bit more of a video buff...I can always upgrade to sound to the video if I want to...but I can't upgrade and image if it doesn't exist....
Hope some of the above made sense....
thanks for you time
J.L.
PS: check out the WCSB-DVD....see how they chopped off the Berkeley footage and all the other footage from previous releases(the making of EL DVD has some Newport footage(the time coded stuff we have here) and it is chopped off as well...you don't see the time code now...but nevertheless the image has been chopped......not that it is a lot but we get a few more pieces of Purple Haze show and Hear My Train 1st...and they go a hack it up.
It just one of my dis-likes of the treatment of Hendrix Legacy.

copen

10-13-11, 10:27 AM

a time-coded VHS, and that I have 'liberated' here on CTT.

why does your liberated version have a loud crackling noise on the right channel (and a minor crackling noise on the left channel) throughout the video.

J.Lucas

10-13-11, 11:25 AM

I have "a film about Jimi Hendrix" 2006 2 disc version for Finnish market and it has only cropped version of the film on disc 1. Does U.K. version have a menu option for non-cropped version?

No MENU option.....you flip the disc over....full on one side of disc, wide screen on the other
J.L.

bolexje

10-13-11, 01:29 PM

why does your liberated version have a loud crackling noise on the right channel (and a minor crackling noise on the left channel) throughout the video.

I have never noticed that crackling, but my source is a 20+ year old VHS tape, and VHS sound is not great, especially by nowadays standards.
But as I mentioned in my remarks earlier in this thread: PLEASE , let somebody here come forward and make a good-sounding BOG version, feel free to use my torrent, and put it up here again !

J.Lucas

10-13-11, 05:12 PM

....... PLEASE , let somebody here come forward and make a good-sounding BOG version, feel free to use my torrent, and put it up here again !

It would get pulled...wouldn't it?
because of 'officially' released material....otherwise someone would have probably put up the color footage of 'Fire' with the GOG 'Fire' on WCSB...don't know about the 'Stepping Stone' audio....for the color footage....and I think the time-coded footage could be 'cropped' out(wide screen format) without losing any image.

In the BOX of Gypsys booklet there is a reference to 'crackling' from the video mics....
9415

bolexje

10-14-11, 02:24 AM

It would get pulled...wouldn't it?

I think you're right. Pity...

As for the sound article: the crackling could be in the basic sound recording.
To my belief the video crew did not put their own mikes, but used the housemix of the filmore.
Here is a jpg of ( I think..) the original writing on the tape, and it states : 'House Mix '
9416

Chris M

10-14-11, 03:00 AM

Not sure if it has been mentioned but I noticed the blue lines or streaks on IOW are greatly reduced on the new release. Much more enjoyable IMO.

themusocat

06-25-12, 02:45 AM

i'd like to know more about the new woodstock dvd reissue. if it does have alternate camera angles in the bonus features.[/QUOTE]
Which one is this, is there a link to it

ranasakawa

06-25-12, 02:51 AM

What new Woodstock DVD release do you refer to? The latest release was from 2010 on DVD.

This special two-disc DVD presentation of Jimi Hendrix: Live At Woodstock stands as the definitive record of one of Jimi's most celebrated performances. This deluxe set features all of the existing film footage from Jimi's unforgettable August 1969 Woodstock concert newly re-edited and presented uninterrupted and in its original performance sequence. Live At Woodstock includes never-before-seen versions of "Foxey Lady," "Message To Love," "Hey Joe," "Spanish Castle Magic," and "Lover Man," and an all-new 5.1 and 2.0 stereo soundtrack mixed by Eddie Kramer, Jimi's original studio engineer.

www.amazon.com

ranasakawa

06-25-12, 02:58 AM

http://www.amazon.com/Jimi-Hendrix-Live-at-Woodstock/dp/B0033AGPGC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1340610603&sr=8-1&keywords=hendrix+woodstock

jhendrixfanatic

08-28-12, 11:25 PM

the first shots of this Allman Brothers video really shows what the inside of the Filmore East looked like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVV3ByMK6g4&feature=related